Ms. Delta on Black and White

My conversation with a dear friend, Ms. Delta, started off about a colleague of ours–a black man–who dates white women. Whatev. Date who you want to date. But the thing about his self-identification as a black nationalist is that it doesn’t make sense. To me, at least. Turns out, it doesn’t make much sense to her either.

Here, only in part, is our conversation that quickly turned macro. It ended up being the most important part of the conversation and merely brushed the surface of a rather large area.


MsInklination: That’s what’s most disappointing to me. I know he dates white girls. And a lot of that I think has to do with him irresponsibly exerting his black masculinity (just as I believe it’s the case for a lot of the types like him). If I were a white woman, I couldn’t reconcile dating a guy who espouses the ideologies he does. But then again, I imagine a part of that has to do with said white woman’s brokenness too.

Ms. Delta: This brother is tripping! He could lose everything, [this game he’s playing].

MsInklination: Maybe he wants to lose it all. Keep playing the system until he loses. Is crushed then respond “I was set up to fail!”

Ms. Delta: Seems he has a problematic or skewed definition of black masculinity. Why he feel he need that kind of power or control over a woman? I don’t respect no grown ass man that goes there.

MsInklination: His view of black masculinity is so skewed I’m not sure what it is, actually. I’ve never known a black militant man who’s almost dismissive of black women. They may date white women but just don’t see black women at all? That’s new to me.

Ms. Delta: I know many smart, militant brothers who date white girls. The thing is, the way he talks about his lived experience as a black man and his supposed close relationships and respect for black women (mom and grandma) isn’t adding up. That is whimsical, not his reality.

Fairly though, many militant men wouldn’t dare date a white woman. The ones I know who do are smart, critical race theory kind if brothers.

MsInklination: But those are the only black women I’ve ever heard him talk about. Otherwise, it’s the LGBTQ community. I can’t help but wonder now if some of his stories and recollections are–and I can’t believe I’m about to say this–exaggerated. Revisionist history filled with a bit more salaciousness that is sexier for who you’re looking to be known as now.

Ms. Delta: That’s the only ones I have heard him talk about. As in most privileged men, we black women are still invisible. All I know is that I see him differently and even ponder if he creates some of his own issues to keep up with his notion of black masculinity. I don’t know.

MsInklination: Hmph. Ain’t that the truth. And yes, I think you’re exactly right.

Ms. Delta: When this creepy shit blows up (trust me, it will), I don’t wanna see no [commentary] about how he is being screwed over as a black man. Some black men don’t even have the opportunity to do that dumb crap. They would never do that. I’ve obviously gotten a little angry.

MsInklination: That’s fine. I like you angry. It affirms my emotional responses about this.

Makes me think of the groups of men that came out to challenge My Brother’s Keeper. It seemed a bit disingenuous to me—the concern for girls and young women of color. [And when they] made sure to point out in a statement that the collective of men were straight, queer and transgender. I don’t have an issue with that, but how is it immediately relevant?

Ms. Delta: They know not much of the plight of women of color obviously, or they wouldn’t have gone there. And I, actually, don’t remember him specifically talking about black women much at all, outside of his mom

MsInklination: Here’s the thing: He often talks about white supremacy and white folks as though that excludes white women.

Ms. Delta: Does he EVER implicate white women in the racist system?

MsInklination: You know I’ve never realized how, largely, people never acknowledge (at minimum) white women’s complicity in supremacy. That’s at minimum.

Ms. Delta: … They fall into that idea of the innocence of freakin’ white women.

MsInklination: Just like a white man …

Ms. Delta: They could never be racist. Give me a break! In my research, many, many racist accounts are perpetrated by white women! Yep, just like a white man. And that is why it really, really scares me.

MsInklination: Shux, yes. White women can be far more manipulative than their imbecile male counterparts. I suppose just how we women, in general, can be.

Ms. Delta: Absolutely.

MsInklination: There’s no way systems of oppression could have been built and maintained without white women’s buy in and assistance proselytizing it. That further causes issues in our interactions with them. That’s why they, in general, don’t like and are distrustful of us. Because I see you, heifer. I know you. I know what you’re capable of because I know what I’m capable of!

Ms. Delta: But they are victims of the system (says most everyone). That is why I often have problems with them. I don’t trust the tramps as far as I can throw them.

MsInklination: They’re as much victims as we are all victims of any type of oppressive situation, though.

Ms. Delta: They play blind way too much–can only talk about sexism from a white perspective.

MsInklination: But they win. A lot. They’re self-focused. They’ve been taught to be that way. That’s what their feminism allows. A focus on white women who have money. Whose ancestors owned land. We don’t have the privilege of only focusing on those who are just like us.

Ms. Delta: Its something … I see men have the privilege, even black ones, of talking about gender but only from a male centered perspective… You rarely see that when looking at women of color

MsInklination: Black men say they don’t have privilege. And it frustrates me. I hate to do too much arguing because no one else is getting lynched in the middle of the street like black men are. I don’t want to seem insensitive to press the issue, but there’s privilege in patriarchy.

Ms. Delta: Well, in many cases they don’t have privilege. But it is definitely contextual. I often think I cannot argue on who is most oppressed; we both are, but in very different and profound ways. I acknowledge theirs, but I need black men to acknowledge mine so we can work on ours.

Ms. Delta: Yep. I’m angry. I better go walk the dog

What about you? Do you ever consider women in your conversations about dominant culture? When you talk about white supremacy, is there space for white women in that conversation? Brothers, how often do women come to mind when you discuss the challenges facing us all?

I’ll post more of my thoughts on this conversation in the next couple days.


~ by MsInklination on August 28, 2014.

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